Don and Angela
in New Zealand

Two Americans emigrate to New Zealand from Colorado,
USA. We talk about our life in Nelson, New Zealand.

A common New Zealand fern, changing colour mid-summer.

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July 2009

June 2009   |   Blog home   |   August 2009

DATE

Click on any blog entry to read it

5

Three years and counting

11

Swine flu news from New Zealand

15

Vive le Tour, in our house anyway

20

First half recap of le Tour du jour

26

Earthquakes rocking and rolling us

29

Let me tell you about our scary socialised medical system

 

 

 

 

 

5 July: Three years and counting

By Angela (read more of Angela's stuff on her pages!)

Tomorrow is our third anniversary of moving to New Zealand. I will always remember a few things around this day based on our great adventure in 2006 ... We departed on 4 July, what we now call 'our independence day.' Today 5 July is Allyssa's birthday and because we left Colorado on 4 July, we lost the day going over the international dateline and missed her birthday. Then we landed on 6 July, my dad's birthday and it was his 60th that year, so I'll remember that too.

And as I write this I am remembering that my dad's birthday closely follows Father's Day in June, d'oh!! I never remember Father's Day in America anymore because Father's Day is in September here. But I have an informal agreement with my dad that he can celebrate it twice a year with his two kids in America and New Zealand, since my usual forgetfulness is compounded by the fact that the holiday doesn't exist here.

Happy birthday Allyssa!

Happy birthday dad!

We landed after a very cold June, and we walked into temperate winter weather. Most of the South Island had had several snow storms and freezing temperatures. Luckily our acclimation began under less dire circumstances. (We're getting paid back this year, though. Brrr.)

I like to think back to that year and the excitement of our big leap overseas. There was a lot that we planned out meticulously, nearly all of which went according to plan. Even our shipping container came spot on time - usually a guaranteed delay is included with the bill. We slept for two and a half months on an air mattress, bundled in blankets and sheets we'd shipped in advance of our arrival.

We rented a car for our last few days and I remember Don dropping me at the airport terminal with our mass of bags - two massive duffels, two super large suitcases, and two carryons each including computer and hard drive and important papers. I was left at the door while he returned the rental car, and of course he dropped me at the wrong end of the terminal.

One cannot abandon a single bag anywhere in the airport, let alone a pile of bags, so I was challenged with how to get the bags down to the counter. One by one, I pushed and carried them about five metres at a time until I got into the check in line and had to push all at once as the line shortened.

I slept nearly through every hour on the plane, I think the adrenaline left and the weariness of all the work took over. We landed in rain but it didn't really matter. I remember being disappointed to get my resident's visa at the customs counter, it was just a black ink stamp that wasn't fully legible on my passport. Perhaps they should consider having horns and balloons and a band to welcome people, I would've liked that.

Don remembers that final picture we took of us leaving, with the luggage loaded in the boot of the rental, us leaving our house for the last time. And then he remembers the plane taking off for Los Angeles and us saying, 'this is it, this is a trip that we're not coming back from.'

We both look back with big smiles, it was a really great adventure in the most exciting sense of the word. I wish everyone would take that leap at some point in their lives, it's worth every minute.

Immigration story

I encourage everyone to read our full immigration story. There's lots of information and lots of highs and lows.

Make a blog comment

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Your comments:

Your last part of the post...about leaving on a trip you won't return from this time...made me cry. We are just starting our journey to NZ.  Will be visiting in March to check out areas around BoP. I cannot imagine our family of 3 getting on that flight for the last time leaving America.  Such a sentimental concept.... Thanks for sharing all your adventures!
~ HappyCampers
happy anniversary!
~ lindsay

11 July: Swine flu news from New Zealand

By Angela (read more of Angela's stuff on her pages!)

When I was in America last month, the issue of swine flu had just blossomed around the world, yet the two airports I travelled through - Los Angeles and Seattle - were oddly absent signage, health information workers, or paper information. Yet when I returned to Auckland I was given a form to fill in on the airplane before I landed, greeted with signs and health workers, and told to phone up if I displayed symptoms within seven days.

Maybe it's because it's winter here. Swine flu seems to (still) be everywhere in New Zealand. It's a constant news story and it's covered in the papers all the time. I'm over it, honestly. It's not that bad of a flu, from what I understand, you may not even have nausea and vomiting in some cases! That's not a real flu. At least until it mutates and transforms into a deadly hideous disease.

New Zealand has had six swine flu deaths as of yesterday. BIG DEAL! I understand all of these people have had underlying illnesses, so it's likely that ANY flu would have killed them. But none of these deaths would have been reported if just any old flu killed these folks. So the fear continues.

At work there is a swine flu plan of sorts in case staffers are out of work en masse and the office has to operate on minimal staff. And there is this massive flow chart that takes up two and a half pages on what to do if you have symptoms, can you work from home, have you been exposed to anyone that is sick, do you take sick leave, and on and on and on. I guess there have to be contingency plans like this, but it's kind of funny that more people die from the regular flu each year, I'm guessing (and I think I'm right), than have died from swine flu, yet we only now have this massive contingency plan.

Even further: the Ministry of Health announced the eligibility for a free seasonal influenza vaccine has been extended to all New Zealanders, not just those with under-lying health problems. This year, everyone is getting the goods, at least through September. But not in any other year, just this swine-flu-year.

It does seem this year that EVERYONE at work is sick. People are gone left and right, and I got word today that our district health board is asking Nelson residents to not get mad if their appointments are rescheduled next week because they've been having a real shortage of staffers out ill.

Something's going around, whether swine flu or other flu or cold or another germ - all I know for sure is that I've not gotten anything so far..............................

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Your comments:

Here in Texas, they closed schools for an entire week because of Swine Flu scare.  Sheesh.  The number of folks that die from regular flu are MUCH MUCH greater than the Swine Flu deaths.  I don't get the panic...
~ HappyCampers

15 July: Vive le Tour, in our house anyway

By Don (read more of Don's stuff on his pages!)

Yes it is that time of the year again. With every July comes the Tour de France and, for us, 3 plus hours of watching each night (I'd watch the full coverage but I do have Angela to consider and I think 3 hours is her max). I record the live coverage each day and we start watching right after work. It's too bad that our local sports channel only covers the Tour as I would love to also be able to watch the Giro and spring classics.

I know you are probably thinking, how can someone watch 3 hours of cycling in one sitting? To begin with I guess you have to really enjoy cycling (as I do). I love the strategy, the passion, and the speed. These riders are warriors - when they crash, they get up and race on, even with torn clothing and blood pouring off of them (this isn't soccer where guys are injured just by being tripped). It appears to most that this isn't a team sport but to be competitive riders must be strong individually and have a strong team. The competition can be fierce yet most of these guys get along with each other. I also like the raw emotion of the winners - it's as if this sport has avoided the heavy amount of showboating and self promotion that has crept into a lot of others (the extent of it in cycling is the raising of arms when winning a stage).

The scenery in most cycling events is fantastic - the cameras on both the motorcycles and helicopters give great views of the countryside. Nothing like watching the many colors of the peloton winding its way up a mountain or snaking through the narrow streets of a medieval town.

The fans also add to the overall atmosphere. On the climbs you get everything from half naked men (and sometime fully naked unfortunately) to the famous elderly devil running alongside the riders. The hillsides are littered with people of all ages that, in some cases, have camped out for days prior to the stage so they can get prime viewing positions. Favorite riders names are written in chalk on the road all they way up the mountain. At the top, the road is completely covered by fans who only part as the racers get within a meter or so. On the flat stages, the peloton races by too quickly to run beside the riders but there are still people at the roadside throughout. For the Tour, fans also spend their time creating various artwork in the fields along the route for the TV cameras (you'll have to watch to know what I'm talking about). In the finish towns fans line the streets to watch the 70km/ hr sprints. No other sport lets you get this close to the athletes. And, to top it all off, no admission charge, it's free to everyone!

Finally, the commentary is the best of any sport I have watched. Phil Liggett (famous for his Liggettisms - one of my favorite: "He's really having to dig deeply into his suitcase of courage") and Paul Sherwen are legendary. I could listen to these guys all day. I've watched a ton of American sports but the announcers in those events actually detract from the event. In a lot of cases it's better to have the sound turned down. Seriously, have you ever had the displeasure of listening to Troy Aikman or Dan Fouts - terrible (I did enjoy listening to Mike Haines for Avalanche games but that's it). Not only do they comment on the race, they add valuable insight into the strategy and riders. Beyond that, they also give history of the regions, towns, and various chateaus, monasteries, and churches. Classic.

Now I know what everyone thinks about when cycling is mentioned (beyond Lance and the Tour that is). Yes, doping has been an issue over the years in this sport. I know there have been many problems with use of performance enhancing drugs but I'm still optimistic (or gullable as a mate of mine says but he's a bit more of a skeptic). There is a long history of doping in one form or another in cycling but I really think things are getting better. These guys are tested more than any other sport (heck, Lance has probably been tested more than the whole of the 3 major US sports combined) - guessing if athletes in other sports were tested this much, you'd see the same issues. In most American sports player unions trump testing - privacy is always pointed to as more important. The two main American cycling teams - Garmin and Columbia - have led the way in anti-doping. I'm not naive, i'll call out the cheats when I spot them (mainly those unbelievable performances raise the question marks). In any case, I'll continue to enjoy the sport and believe that some day soon, all the anti-drugging measures will keep the cheats to a minimum.

So my picks this year (made prior to start):

Yellow, podium placings - Contador, Sastre, Evans

Green - Friere (probably will be Cav but Friere won it for me last year)

Mountain - Moncoutie (I think it will be a French rider so he's my pick).

Lance finishing position - 5th

I'll post a recap of the race to the Alps towards the end of the week.

For full coverage check out Cyclingnews.com

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Your comments:

I watch the Tour mainly for the scenery I must admit. It comes on here in the afternoon, so when I'm working on something around the house, like ironing or sewing I love to have it on. Your right about it being relaxing to watch, I think sometimes the commentators take short naps in between! Seriously though, it is one of my favorite sporting events to watch on tv since I'm a road trip junkie and I love France.
~ Siggie

20 July: First half recap of le Tour du jour

By Don (read more of Don's stuff on his pages!)

Well it's been a great Tour so far - best first week I've seen. Granted most will think the second week was a bit slow and predictable (Cav wins) but it still had some great moments. [Angela: yes, second week was a SNOOZER. Let's move along to the mountains already.]

Stage 1: Monaco for the opening time trial. One of the best I've seen at a tour. 15 km with some climbing and crazy descents. Lance and Levi start early to avoid any afternoon weather problems. Fabian Cancellara, "Spartacus" as he's known, takes a convincing win. The guy can TT like no other. Lance hangs in there but not in top form - finishes 10th losing 40 seconds to Fabian and about 20 to Alberto Contador.

Stage 2: Fantastic scenery throughout, Mark Cavendish wins by a mile (will become a common theme). The last 5kms are fast and exciting but Columbia is too much for everyone else. Cav is the fastest sprinter in the world right now and almost impossible to beat straight up when Columbia gets the train going.

Stage 3: Very interesting day. Cav wins the sprint after Columbia breaks the race apart in the cross winds. They get their whole team up from and wind splits the group. The interesting part is that Lance is the only contender paying attention and gets in the split, he gains 40 seconds on the rest.

Stage 4: Fantastic team time trial, very technical with narrow roads and lots of turns. Astana puts in the best time but Garmin gets my vote as the best effort - using only 4 riders to do all the work after dropping 4 early on - a fifth just held on the back as the teams time is measured by the 5th rider crossing the line. They took second only 18 seconds back. Saxo Bank takes 3rd @ 40sec. Cadel Evans is the big loser - his team finished 13th @ 2:35. Ouch.

Stage 5: French get a win as Thomas Voekler takes off on his breakaway companions later in the race and just hold on for the win by 7sec over the main bunch. A young talent Robert Gesink crashes at the wrong time and can't make it back to the fast charging peloton. His injury prevents him starting stage 6. He's a rider to watch for the future.

Stage 6: David Miller (Garmin) is caught in final 2km after getting away from his breakaway group. Thor Hushovd - god of thunder - wins an uphill sprint. Felt bad for Miller - great effort. Amazing that he got caught within 2kms but finished about 1:30 back.

Stage 7: First mountain stage. Brice Feillu wins - the next great French hope. Nocentini now in yellow. Most interesting is that Contador attacks toward the top of the final climb and gets 20 seconds on Lance. According to Astana, this was not the plan, but Lance had an idea Alberto might do it. Alberto was behind Lance in the standings but now he's ahead of him by 2 sec. Really odd move but shows that Alberto is in it to win it. Lance was a team player and didn't go with Alberto or try to catch him. The other favorites should have gone with Contador - I'm really not sure why they didn't. [Angela: the official day I stopped rooting for Contador, and by rooting I mean cheering. Was totally a d**k move.]

Stage 8: Another mountain stage but an odd one as the final climb is 40kms from the finish. Cadel attacks but goes no where, good on him for trying. Cadel does get scolded by Fabian and Hincapie when it becomes clear that their breakaway won't be able to get any time with Cadel there - Astana wouldn't let a contender get in a breakaway. LL Sanchez gets win out of a breakaway.

Stage 9: Another breakaway, 2 tough climbs but last one 70k from finish. Pierrick Fedrigo gets win over Franco Pellizotti. Great finish.

Stage 10: Sprint - Cav over Thor (Cervelo) and Tyler Farrar (Garmin). Nuff said.

Stage 11: Cav just beats out Tyler (by just it was about a half bike length). Garmin tried to get their own lead out train for Tyler Farrar but it just didn't work. Columbia just too strong. Cav now in green jersey.

Stage 12: Nicki Sorensen - breakaway - good job of pulling away from breakaway group. Levi breaks wrist in last 2.5kms - out of Tour. Really sucks.

Stage 13: Heinrich Haussler wins - breakaway - took off on Chavanel who completely and utterly bonked. Great win for the Aussie-German rider for Cervelo. Great win for Haussler who's having a really good season - he just got beat at the line in Milan-San Remo by Cav.

Stage 14: Large breakaway with Hincapie and he just misses yellow. Turns out there is a lot of controversy. Not in our house, Angela and I are in agreement. If Hincapie had the legs to get yellow and he had the heart of a champion, he'd be in yellow. [Angela: he needed five seconds, it was his own fault he didn't get those five seconds - it's only 5 SECONDS!! Take some resonsibility Georged, I watched you fart around the last 20km when you coulda got those 5 seconds.] If he didn't have the legs and is nothing more than a great helper, he wouldn't. Well, he didn't get it. Astana, and Lance, did their best to "gift" the yellow to Hincapie - well whatever happened to "no gifts" as quoted by Lance? Well Astana, why don't you help George tomorrow if you want to see him in yellow? Oh, doesn't suit your plan. Got it. Anyway, Garmin riding hard on the front in the last 5kms was baffling but Silence Lotto was there too. No matter, they have a reason and don't have to answer to anyone for it. Sorry George, wish you were in yellow but you just didn't have it. In other news, Cav gets relegated to last due to irregular sprinting - good news for Thor. And finally - sad news about the lady that was hit by a motorcycle and killed.

Further, there has been an ongoing battle for both the mountain and green jerseys which has been interesting.

To get some additional insight into what the riders deal with, check out these twitter pages and blog:

http://twitter.com/mcewenrobbie - not in the Tour but always has good insight.
http://twitter.com/vaughters
http://twitter.com/wegelius
http://twitter.com/andy_schleck
http://twitter.com/ChristianVDV
http://twitter.com/Bradwiggins
http://twitter.com/levileipheimer

Cycling News blogs.

For full coverage check out Cyclingnews.com

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26 July: Earthquakes rocking and rolling us

By Angela (read more of Angela's stuff on her pages!)

Many of you by now have heard about the big earthquake in the South Island off Fiordland. I got three early morning emails from family and friends asking if we were OK, that's how I first heard. Apparently it could be felt up here at the opposite end of the South Island, but I didn't notice it. The funny news I read the other day was that apparently it moved the entire island closer to Australia - d'oh! Just what we kiwis don't want.

From My Yahoo alert:

The magnitude 7.8 quake, centered in the ocean near Resolution Island in the country's Fiordland region, twisted South Island out of shape and moved its southern tip 12 inches (30 centimeters) closer to Australia...

I guess if the quake had been in a more populated area, we'd be in big trouble! But we were lucky. It is a timely event, though, as those of you who read each post may remember a few weeks ago I alerted you to my upcoming multi-part series on New Zealand and earthquakes, and here is the first part!

Now, the content I am sharing with you on earthquakes is NOT my own writing, I have compiled it from a few sources I want to cite up front: most of the content is from Eileen McSaveney. 'Earthquakes', Te Ara - the Encyclopedia of New Zealand, updated 21-Sep-2007, URL: http://www.TeAra.govt.nz/EarthSeaAndSky/NaturalHazardsAndDisasters/Earthquakes/en

A bit of text was also found at the GNZ site, http://www.gns.cri.nz/index.html

Earthquakes in New Zealand, Part 1:

Earthquakes happen every day in New Zealand. Instruments record the ground shaking from over 14,000 earthquakes in and around the country each year. Most are too small to be noticed, but between 150 and 200 are big enough to be felt.

Records dating from the 1840s show that, on average, New Zealand can expect several magnitude 6 earthquakes every year, one magnitude 7 every 10 years, and an 8 every century. But large earthquakes are not evenly spaced, and they sometimes arrive in bunches. [Interesting about the magnitude 7 statistic, so maybe we're done for the decade!]

The most powerful New Zealand earthquake on record occurred in the Wairarapa [lower central North Island, Wellington area] in 1855 and had a magnitude of about 8.2. During this quake, land moved along at least 140 kilometres of the Wairarapa Fault. Where the movement was greatest, the land shifted horizontally more than 18 metres along the fault, and part of the adjacent Rimutaka Range rose more than 6 metres. About 5000km2 of land was shifted vertically.

[It also has to be said that tsunamis can result from earthquakes out in the ocean, and we are always on lookout for this when it happens, the local geo folks alert us as to whether there is a tsunami warning or not.]

New Zealand is in a region that straddles the boundary between the Pacific Plate, which covers almost a quarter of the earth’s surface, and the Australian Plate. The country is the visible part of a largely submerged small continent. The islands New Zealanders live on are the continent’s highlands, thrust above sea level by the collision of the Australian and Pacific plates. The boundary between these two moving plates runs diagonally through the country.

The North Island and its continental shelves, which lie under the sea, are on the Australian Plate, as is the land west of the Alpine Fault in the South Island. The rest of the South Island is part of the Pacific Plate. The pattern of earthquakes in New Zealand reflects the activity of the plates along their boundaries.

Subduction

Where a plate with thin oceanic crust collides with a plate with continental crust, the plate with the ocean crust is forced down under the continental plate and into the subsurface – a process called subduction. Friction, however, prevents the down-going plate from sliding under smoothly. As it descends it drags against the overlying plate, and eventually the crust of the overlying plate fractures, shifts or crumples, causing frequent shallow earthquakes. [We feel these a lot.]

Much more rarely, a large area of the down-going oceanic plate overcomes friction and abruptly shoves its way further under the overlying plate. This can produce very powerful earthquakes, which scientists call subduction earthquakes. Some of the largest earthquakes in the world, with magnitudes greater than 9, have been subduction earthquakes. Subduction is responsible for earthquakes in many New Zealand regions.

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29 July: Let me tell you about our scary socialised medical system

By Angela (read more of Angela's stuff on her pages!)

I am hearing all the talk in the States about people freaking out about the proposed changes in the medical system. Socialisation!!! SCARY, TERRIFYING!!! I was so excited that Obama was elected for so many reasons, but most of all because I believed he would change the medical system in the US. I want so badly for him to fix it, and I know lots of people do as well. But the scare tactics are coming up like weeds now, and the articles I read are showing cracks in people’s interest.

Most notably, apparently people are now growing fond of their health-for-profit system. The word 'socialism' is more prevalent than ever.

New Zealand has socialised medicine. I don't wake up at night with nightmares, or even sweats. I have blogged many times about the medical system, you can read about it over the past several years. Here's a new one: a list of pros about our medical system, read for yourself how awful it is here.

One

My doctor decides what is wrong with me, tells me what will fix me, orders tests and prescribes medicine, not a bureaucrat. In fact, no one at the government level has gotten involved yet in my medical care.

Two

If my doctor prescribes a drug, no matter the duration of the prescription, the approved version of the drug is about $4. I can get the drug for 30 days or 12 months, ANY duration. $4. Approved versions are the negotiated brands of the medicine the government approves for use (just like I understand they do with Medicare, only here it saves money).

Even better ... I opt out of the approved version of a medication I take regularly because it doesn't work for me the way another brand of the same drug does. I can get this drug, and the $4 goes to $30. TRAGIC!! (being sarcastic).

Three

I can see the doctor or the nurse on the same day I call, at least that has been my experience. No long waits, no being put on a list. And if I don't have to go full out to see the doctor cuz I only have the flu, I can pay less to see the nurse - options at lower cost!

Four

Follow up stuff is free. Xrays, tests, procedures, whatever comes out of your doctor’s orders is free care. No percentage split, no insurance hassle, no rejections for procedures. IT'S FREEEEEEEEEEEEE.

Five

I find it funny that people think we all go on lists here and wait forever for our medical care. In fact, most care is handled relatively quickly. Even if you have to wait a month or two for a non-urgent procedure, what is the harm? If you think about how much time it takes to fight the insurance company to get a procedure or test approved, we might even be ahead of the game.

Six

As a nation New Zealand (and pretty much every country outside the US) pays waaayyyyyy less for care and medications. Medicines, machines, procedures cost far less than they do in the States. I’ve seen the cost of specific surgeries - the information is out there, not hidden and the price of a surgery doesn't differ between doctors.

I know myself that a treatment I received in the US was billed at $2k through insurance but when I asked how much it would cost me here out of pocket, only $300 US dollars – this is the rule, not the exception. So the phrase I keep hearing on the news is true: Americans pay heaps more for less health care than every other country in the world.

Seven

I pay for dental appointments. A cleaning is $75, a visit to the dentist for a checkup is $95 and fillings are $100-$150. Does that sound awful? Well, consider that I used to have dental insurance in the US, paid about $40/month (after my employer's unknown $ portion). Even then, I had to pay $50 to see my dentist and a high percentage of my filling cost, I recall this being well over $200 for a couple of cavities one time. Not that much difference – except I don’t pay the premium.

Eight

Living here with socialised medicine, I am assured that a medical emergency, a serious illness, or a life threatening situation is not going to make me go completely broke or bankrupt – the system doesn’t work that way because you don’t pay the exorbitant costs of your own care, especially serious care. It’s about peace of mind as you get older and retire, and even before while you save to retire. You won’t have to spend your life’s savings because some insurance company said ‘no’ to health care that you absolutely need.

Nine

I don't have to pay for medical insurance for any of this care (there is insurance but it offers different coverage). Yes, taxes are higher here, but they pay for a number of benefits, not just the health system. I won’t go into what all the benefits are, but one example is called ACC, a sane version of Worker’s Compensation – costs for accidents are fully covered by this government program. This means NO LAWSUITS, driving down overall costs.

Ten ... and most important

Health care is a right, not a privilege. Is the case in pretty much every westernized country except the US. It’s not a business that needs to earn a profit on whether someone is well or ill, lives or dies. Period (full stop).

Contribute to the conversation

I extend an INVITATION TO ALL EXPATS now living in New Zealand who care to add to my blog - share your stories about your experience with the socialised system here. It's not all roses and bon bons, but it is vastly better than what I left. And the US medical system is the single most important reason I don't plan to live in America again - read #8.

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Your comments:

hear hear!!  In my job I'm learning all about the NZ health care system, and specifically, how ACC works, and I'm a huge fan.  I could rip my hair out when I read the US news and all the resistance to health care reform there.  they're mad!  We kiwis have got it made!! 
~ Lindsay
Really enjoyed your most recent post on health care. You may be interested in a discussion I started on the New Zealand immigration forum. It has provides some excellent analysis and info from Americans living in New Zealand: http://www.emigratenz.org/forum/showthread.php?t=26248
~ posted as generic comment
Amen. I could not agree with you more and sincerely hope Obama's bill goes through. I was born and raised in Canada and lived 10 yrs in the U.S., and now have immigrated to New Zealand. So, I have lived back and forth between the two systems. I strongly prefer the nationalized medicine because of the very reasons you explained. My taxes are exactly the same as they were in Utah, we do not fear having our insurance suddenly rescind our benefits if one of us were to get an expensive disease, and my husband can be self employed without fear of being underinsured or paying $1000 per month for insurance like my father does (he is a self employed contractor). My American friends have used the words "terrified" and "horrified" and "communistic" in regards to socialised medicine. Yet they have not lived in other countries to experience it. I've heard it well said from others I have corresponded with: "The scaremongers choose to highlight the cases in which people are denied care or receive delayed care, and ignore the cases in the current US for-profit system that underhandedly encourages people who develop serious illness to be fired from employment so that the insurer can keep a handle on costs. America has a very vocal minority of media entertainers that many listen to seriously."
~ Angela F.
Very interesting points of view from the "inside" of a socialized health program.  Curious what your thoughts are though on how it might compare to the US and what the US is trying to do.
Do you think that NZ has been successful because there is a vastly smaller number of people to support, illegal immigration isn't a problem like it is in the US?  It is also my understanding that NZ is a much less litigious society in general compared to the US...this plays a huge roll in the current state of the US medical care system.
Is the NZ government less corrupt and more successful at managing healthcare?  I just can't see the US being successful in this endeavor...even taking Medicaid/Medicare into consideration, it is so costly and a tangle of paperwork, legalities, rising costs, etc. 
I always like your posts...I'm curious what you think about my thoughts!
~ Happy Campers

I admit to not knowing what the US is proposing to do in detail, I only hear what I hear from CNN and podcasts I listen to. My post was specifically about the growing fear people have to socialised systems. I couldn't possibly do a comparison as to the proposed US system and what we have here.

NZ may have a smaller number of people, but we have fewer doctors, hospitals, etc. Everything is proportional. The States manages Medicare jussssst fine, doesn't it. That covers a buncha people and polls show they are pretty satisfied for the most part - except for the recent trend that doctors refuse to serve Medicare-only patients because they can't afford to cover the cost of the care they provide because Medicare doesn't reimburse actual cost. Money money money. It's tragic, really.

The reason NZ is a less litigious society is due in part to the ACC programme, see No Nine in my post. But a HUGE part of this is because people are willing to pay for the system, they believe every person has a right to healthcare and I don't hear the same majority opinion in America - never have.

Corruption doesn't even come into play in my mind ... what do you call the actions taken by insurance companies who decide medical services based on profit motives? Enough said on that one!

Thanks for the post Happy Campers.

~ Angela

Good points!  And just for the record...I don't think some of the insurance companies are any less corrupt than parts of our US government! :) 
~ Happy Campers
My real first experience with NZ healthcare was about 4 months after I shifted here (from Boston, in 1996)  when I discovered we were pregnant.  I found a GP (hadn't organised one before that) and she thought I might be carrying twins. She said, better to get a scan fairly early rather than waiting for the scheduled 20 weeks one, so she organised for me to go "private" for the scan. I went to the OB, had a scan (not twins!), then presented myself at the reception desk. The receptionist said, "that will be $20 please". I almost fell over! $20 for an ultrasound?? 
For my subsequent children, I had no need for private care, so both were entirely free. Can't imagine that happening in the US!
It amazes me to see the vitriol that is spilling out of the "anti-reform" faction in the US. You'd think that we here in NZ spent our lives fearing government intervention in our healthcare decisions and spent our time in front of "death panels" because that's what "socialised medicine" is all about. Sheesh.
~ Brenda
I employ about 45 people here in the States. Health care is one of my biggest problems. While I'm very skeptical of U.S. Government management of almost anything, I have to admit that the large private health insurance carriers are completely out of control and extremely greedy. The problem is very complex here in the States because of outside issues. California has had almost 100 Hospitals close or go into bankruptcy because of over taxed emergency rooms that are used as free care for non-citizens.  Medicare works only when paired with programs that accept private insurance. Private insurance is mandated to cover the 15% of cost that Medicare does not. I am not a fan of socialism but I do believe that "basic human needs" should not be capitalistic. That being said New Zealand's socialized system is managed by people who will protect the system from outsiders (non-citizens). I've even read of a case that citizenship was not allowed for a lady because of her existing weight issue. In the States the far left could easily cause the system to become more than 25% of GDP which in turn would slow economic growth. The far right will always gravitate towards profitability. I wish I had the answer but I'm glad that it is being seriously considered for overhaul.
~ Dean